National Defense Industrial Association 2010


#1

Small Caliber Ammunition Enhancing Capabilities
from 2010 NDIA Joint Armaments Conference

I hope it’s interesting enough…

gyrojet


#2

I must be getting old! When did “Warfighters” become a word, and when did it replace “soldiers,” “troops,” etc. in the english language? Perhaps with the Star Wars movies?

I know, i’m nitpicking. Just sounds so weird to me to see “warfighter” in an English language agenda printed by the U.S. military. Is a “Warfighter” anything like a “Warrior?”

John Moss


#3

John,

A “warfighter” is like a soldier except they are more environmentally sensitive?

Dave


#4

[quote=“gyrojet”]Small Caliber Ammunition Enhancing Capabilities
from 2010 NDIA Joint Armaments Conference

I hope it’s interesting enough…[/quote]
I’m glad to see it. Thanks. Last year the NDIA apparently switched to the latest version of Adobe Acrobat, which my older version can’t view.


#5

Since the US doesn’t fight wars anymore, I guess “warfighter” belongs on the list of oxymorons together with “military intelligence”? ;^)


#6

There were a lot of interesting presentations at that meeting - it was worth attending.


#7

In the “Small Caliber Ammunition Roadmap” part of the information Gyrojet was so kind to post there is an indication that there is development underway of a “Light Weight Case” for the three calibers discussed. (That is if I’m reading it right!). Is there any information on what materials are being worked with to this end? It seems to say that there is funded development of the 7.62 for this up to the end of FY10 with development completion expected in the beginning of FY14.

Thanks,
Dave


#8

Dave, I recall seeing something (In a past NDIA presentation, maybe?) about stainless steel 7.62x51 cases being developed. Weight was reportedly less than for current brass cases.

Stan


#9

Warfighter became common usage over 20 years ago in the US military. The first use I remember was to refer to the combatant commands, the unified commands like EUCOM, PACOM, CENTCOM and SOCOM. These are the joint commands who actually would fight a war. These guys actually work for the JCS. The services (the Chiefs of Staff of the AF and Army, the CNO and the Commondant of the Marine Corp) are not Warfighters. Their role is to “train, organize and equip”. Soldier applies to everybody in the Army. Some have jobs that makes them warfighters (combatants) and some don’t. Same applies to AF, Navy and Marines. The people in a fighter squadron are the “warfighters” because they are the ones who deploy. The same is true for the people in a C-17 transport wing, or a KC-10 refueler wing. These units are chopped to a Warfighter command for actual employment. The people who are in acquisition or in a training command are clearly part of the “train, organize and equip” side of the business and are not “warfigheters”.

Whether you or I like the term or not, it is a very convenient way in the joint environment to describe those who are at the pointed end of the spear.

Cheers, Lew


#10

Stan,

Thanks for that information. I have seen very little on the use of stainless steel for cases. I can imagine there are some significant technical challenges involved in using that material type for Mil Spec SAA. I’ll be sure to look for more on this development.

Lew,

Thank you for the very concise definition of the term “warfighter”. I must admit that the above application was the first time I had seen it used. (I don’t get out much, I guess!) It does seem to be a very uesful term and surprisingly (and refreshingly) out of the norm in these “politically correct” times.

Here’s to the Warfighters!

Dave


#11

Come on Lew - “they started using it twenty years ago.” That’s just about time for the Star Wars movies. Hmmm, “Warfighter.” Since we’re not in any declared wars right now, I guess we don’t have any “Warfighters,” just a bunch of about the greatest soldiers, sailors and airmen (and women) that we have had in our history.

Its a silly term, no matter how its used. Just my humble “civilian tired of the unnecessary rewriting of the English language” opinion. No offense to any of our combat personnel! : )

John Moss


#12

[quote=“DaveE”]Stan,

Thanks for that information. I have seen very little on the use of stainless steel for cases. I can imagine there are some significant technical challenges involved in using that material type for Mil Spec SAA. I’ll be sure to look for more on this development.
[/quote]
Rolled stainless steel, with a light-alloy base plug, is currently the front-runner, stated to achieve a 40% weight reduction in the 7.62x51 case (20% reduction in overall cartridge weight), but there is also a research project taking another look at light-alloy and of course polymer is ongoing. The polymer-cased telescoped LSAT ammo appears to be reaching enough maturity for a 100,000-round order (plus eight LMGs) to be given for May 2011 assessment. They also recently test-fired the first carbine in this calibre. Reading between the lines, the caseless LSAT version is still having technical problems as well as using very expensive propellant: the general view is that it will get nowhere.


#13

Tony,

Ah! A bi-metallic case! Very interesting. Thank you very much for sharing that information. Those should make for some sharp looking collectibles…

Dave


#14

Dave, here’s the NDIA presentation:

dtic.mil/ndia/2007smallarms/ … i_Leng.pdf


#15

Stan,

Thanks for that. The stainless makes for some nice looking ammunition! The construction reminds me of some ammunition being manufactured about 150 years ago…

Dave