Newbie Help please

Good day All, please help ID this cartridge. I know very little about hand gun ammo and have started cataloging my very new collection.

Case Length 18,3mm
Bullet 9,5mm
Rim 10mm

Many thanks,


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9x18 mm Makarov, made at Yuryusan, Chelyabinsk, Russia.

Code 38 was used for Tula until 1941 when it was moved to Yuryusan. Post-1941, 38 indicates Yuryusan.
It closed in 1989, upon which production restarded in Tula, using code 539.


Thank you Ole, need to start learning about these calibers! need help with two more please.

38 S&W on the right for reference.


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British/Commonwealth ammunition is admittably my weakest point but R/|\L is Royal Laboratory, Woolwich, London.

What are the measurements?
Middle looks like .455 Webley, Mk I. As far as I remember the heavy cannelure is a telling sign it’s loaded with cordite (as opposed to blackpowder).


Middle as follows:
Case length 22 mm
Bullet 11,5 mm
Rim 13,5 mm

Left as follows:
Case length 20 mm
Bullet 11 mm
Rim 13 mm


Cartridge on the left is a 10.4mm Italian Ordnance Revolver round made by Pirotechnia di Capua, Italy in 1935. LN does not stand for the maker, but the inspector, Leggiadore, Nicola if dated 1914 - 1935. The C stands for Capua.


10.4 Italian “Bodeo” on the left, British .455 MkI in the center.

Wow, I can’t imagine how the 10.4mm ended up in the middle of the Free State in South Africa??? Last one please guys…

Mkiv Webely?

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Which not to confuse SAAavage is one and the same as 10.4mm Italian Ordnance Revolver.
Other common names are;
10.35mm Bodego
10.35mm Chamelot-Delvigne revolver M. 1874
10.35mm Glisenti M. 1889
10.35mm Italian Revolver
10.4mm Chamelot, Delvigne & Schmidt M. 1872
10.4mm Glisenti Revolver M. 1889


Joe that is enough to get one confused…
I think I will go with 10,4mm Glisenti Italian Revolver C35 for my records.

The last appears to be a MkIV Webley round, but the belt at the case mouth looks odd to me, without running downstairs to look at mine. Does it have a flat bullet tip or a deep/wide hollow point? I’m not sure from the pic.

Flat bullet tip Jonnyc. I am not lucky enough to have a “Man Stopper”


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Thank you, my Mkiv just looks so much older than my Mki…I keep forgetting about Tony E’s site to look up British Military cartridges.

SA Savage,
What is the headstamp on your .38 S&W in the 4th picture?


Dan it is a SANDF cartridge HS 9.65 R1 M1 A80.
The box it comes in has 9.65X19.5R Ball R1M1 on it.


I’m not fimiliar with that headstamp. The bullet looks more Webley than S&W to me.


The South African 9.65mm (38 S&W) was loaded with a projectile with a similar profile to that of a 9x19 para (the one I have is headstamped PMP 72 .380 S&W) later ones would be headstamped as 9.65 much the same as later .303" were headstamped as 7.7mm…the Mk IV .455" is a commercial ‘buy in’ as indicated by the two broad arrows which are accepted into service marks which may explain the ‘odd’ features of this round.


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