Odd Mauser Broomhandle stripper clips


#1

I put in order the archives and have found old record about sale of the Mauser Broomhandle stripper clips. These clips have seemed to me unusual. Here that the seller writes:

[color=#0000FF]Extremely rare stripper clips for Bromhandle Mauser Mod.C96 of the German imperial navy! Navy proof with imperial crown and M for Marine (navy) Stripper clip and feather nickel-plated. Clip has corrosion by use in the navy and seawater. Auction contains three clips, see picture. Rarity for the WWI navy and Mauser collector! [/color]

I saw brands from the manufacturer, but I never saw brands of the customer. Somebody saw such clips? What can you tell about these clips?


#2

I’ve seen a couple of these for sale and missed both of them. Those ones came out of Italy and my guess is that they were made for the Italian Navy who were the first service user of the Mauser C96 which they styled the Model 1899 after the year of adoption.

The picture I have of the marking is a very small file, much cleaned up in Photoshop so my apologies for any shortcomings it might have. The original picture was a very grotty one and this was the best result I could come up with;

Happy collecting, Peter


#3

I’ve seen a couple of them for sale over here.

The crown/M are unmistakingly German Imperial Crown/M’s. But of course that is no guarantee that the Imperial navy either used or accepted them.

Faking of Imperial navy items has been a cottage industry for ages, sadly.


#4

Guys,
excuse, but I think that it is a fake. I didn’t manage to find the proof of existence of such identification mark on clips. Certainly I know that there can be wonderful things which anybody never saw, but I think that it not such case. I have compared proofs on pistols and clips and I can tell that they have differences.


#5

Differences are to be expected between objects.

There were many suppliers of dies, and these had a limited life span as well. That makes spotting or identifying fakes even more difficult.

On the other hand, what would be the financial gain of faking a stripper clip marking?


#6

[quote=“Vlim”]Differences are to be expected between objects.

There were many suppliers of dies, and these had a limited life span as well. That makes spotting or identifying fakes even more difficult.

On the other hand, what would be the financial gain of faking a stripper clip marking?[/quote]
Vlim,

  1. Now we see brands of the user instead of the manufacturer. I never heard that someone ordered manufacture of clips with the your brand.
  2. In Germany there was only one manufacturer of clips for a Mauser С96 pistol - DWM. But DWM were partners of the “Mauser” firm and always branded the your name for any product concerning production of the “Mauser” firm.
  3. I suppose possibility of manufacturing of advertizing party of clips for deliveries together with pistols but then this fact would be known.
  4. Clips for a Mauser pistol having brands cost more expensive of the much more faceless clips.

#7

Impossible to tell for sure but I too think these ‘proofed’ clips are fakes.

As far as I know there are only two clips marked for the end user, these ones and the 7,92x57 ones with the "SS’ markings. Any items marked for the Imperial Kriegsmarine and the ‘SS’ have a significant uplift in their rarity and value, little wonder that they are the most faked markings.

Many clips have a makers mark, a few have patent information or a part number but the only other clip with an indication of the end user are the British made clips for 7,62x54R that have an ‘L’ indicating that they are for Land use.

Cartridge clips are disposable items, made to be used once then thrown away, at least in times of war. There seems to be no point in their having a property mark, if there is one it should be on the packaging holding the clipped ammunition.

Does anyone know when C96 pistols were issued to the German Marine? I know they had some towards the end of the First War but were they issued to units sent to China for the Boxer Rebellion? The Matrosen regiments based in Flanders? Dockyard Police units? Most contemporary pictures show sailors armed with P’08 pistols rather than anything else.

I’d still like one of these little clips though!

Happy collecting, Peter


#8

I have no detailed information on the use of the C96 by the German navy, so any comments on that are purely speculative on my side.

It is possible that the navy (or what was left of it) used the C96 as a replacement during the interbellum period. C96 distribution during war time was mainly to rear and second echelon troops.

It would be nice to locate a sealed package with navy property markings and Crown/M marked stripper clips inside.

Most I’ve seen are completely unmarked, DWM or DM marked.


#9

About the manufacture of stripper clips in Germany:

RWS has them in their 1936 catalog, for the Mauser 7.63, the Mauser 9mm Export and even the 9mm para.

If RWS has them, GeCo has them as well -> same company in those days.

They already had them in their 1922 catalog as well.

FN in Belgium was also producing 7.63 ammunition, so it’s safe to assume they had stripper clips as well. As a former Loewe/DWM subsidiary (like Mauser), FN would have received either the clips or the tooling to make them from Loewe or DWM, like their other tooling sets.

So there are quite a bit of sources for C96 stripper clips, actually.


#10

[quote=“Vlim”]About the manufacture of stripper clips in Germany:

RWS has them in their 1936 catalog, for the Mauser 7.63, the Mauser 9mm Export and even the 9mm para.

If RWS has them, GeCo has them as well -> same company in those days.

They already had them in their 1922 catalog as well.

FN in Belgium was also producing 7.63 ammunition, so it’s safe to assume they had stripper clips as well. As a former Loewe/DWM subsidiary (like Mauser), FN would have received either the clips or the tooling to make them from Loewe or DWM, like their other tooling sets.

So there are quite a bit of sources for C96 stripper clips, actually.[/quote]

All true but we’re talking about the Imperial Navy that ceased to exist in 1918.

Thus far I’ve seen clips marked ‘DM’ and ‘DWM’ from Germany, ‘BP’ and ‘K’ from Britain, ‘SFM’ from France and ‘H’ from Austria. FN seemed to produce most of its clips unmarked which gives a problem of identification except to say that some of the unmarked clips might be by ‘FN’, it would be unwise to say otherwise.

Happy collecting,

Peter


#11

Firstly, it is not surprising that Geco and RWS would have Stripper Clips for the Mauser pistol. They packed ammunition on strippers. Since the 7.63 x 25, the 9 x 19 and the 9 x 25 are all the same base, they take the same clip. So, it also isn’t surprising that they would offer the clip for all three calibers. The Geco/RWS clips are unmarked, and could have come from DWM or any other contractor.

I asked Steve Fuller about German makers of clips when I saw the comment here that only DWM made them (although with DM, DWM and BKIW markings - all the same firm, just different names). I did not think that was correct. Steve had studied that particular charger for years. He agreed with the statement that in Germany, only DWM had made them.


#12

The idea behind my reasoning is quite simple:

When you have a stripper clip with german Imperial markings, it doesn’t mean that the clip was made during the Imperial years. Someone may have taken later GeCo, RWS, FN stripper clips and marked them with imperial navy markings.

Basically I find it hard to believe that only DWM made Mauser stripper clips until 1918, but stranger things have happened :)

The fact remains that until a packaged set of imperial navy marked stripper clips with ammo turns up, these will remain suspect.


#13

I have mentioned on this forum before that I have a Keller-made clip for the 6-shot C.96; it’s marked “KC” I believe (but isn’t at hand). So, a questions occurs: did Keller also make the 10-shot clip? Jack


#14

You are assured that your clip for a cartridge 7.63х25 Mauser? I think that this clip for a cartridge 7.65х25 Mannlicher. Also used its other pistol, not the Mauser. I think that this clip for a pistol of Mannlicher model 1897


#15

2moutrage: Yes, I suppose this could in fact be for one of the Mannlichers (and I had thought of that possibility) but it is dimensionally exactly the same as the ten shot C.96 clip except that it only holds six cartridges. In other words the location of the stop lugs is the same from the ends of the clip as in the C.96 and the curvature of the body the same I think. I’m pretty sure that it would properly load a 6-shot C.96, but maybe it would also load an even more obscure Mannlicher. Given that Keller didn’t make the ten-shot C.96 clip assuming it’s for the Mannlicher seems reasonable. Jack


#16

Josef Mötz, in his first book on Austrian cartridge production, only mentions 10 round clips for the C96 marked with ‘H’ for Hirtenberger.

We mustn’t forget that there was another major producer of 7,63x25 Mauser pistols, the Spanish. Has anyone seem ammunition packaging or the clips themselves that were made in Spain? Are they marked? If not, we have another source of blank 10 round clips.

Happy collecting, Peter