Rare 9x19 Sellier & Bellot 7 g HP


#1

Dear 9x19 collectors,

same years ago I got a 50 rd box 9x19 S&B HP.
HP stands for high performance, high penetration or high power, I dont know. Its a FMJ bullet with a thicker, copper plated steel jacket in the front, but not so thick like the FN Super Penetrating or the M39/B. Bullet weight is 7 g / 108 grs.
The primer is coloured black.
Has someone more informations about this cartridge.
Here are some pics.

Best regards Chris


#2

Perhaps “High Pressure” proof loads?


#3

”High Performance” is the name, what the HP is for. They are a mild penetrator, like the Swedish M/39B and can penetrate soft body armor. Not sure if the S&B intention was to abbreviate in English, or if the Czech translation abbreviates to HP as well?


#4

Thanks for information


#5

From 2015 Military/LE catalog:


#6

Strange that in the S&B catalog they did not differentiate some color on the jacket of the HP 9mm jacket section to indicate the thicker inner steel jacket.


#7

DK - Norma never differentiate on their 9 mm AP either. Out of
the box, there is little way to tell what it is. I am talking about
the commercial rounds, not the military M39b loadings with
red PA & CMS.

John M.


#8

Matt, I assume the black primer is telling about the load.


#9

What I meant about color was not a painted tip or base, I meant that in the actual sectioned cartridge graphic on the catalog page the entire section of the 9mm HP jacket appears as one color through the cut, as if to suggest that it is just thick copper jacket, when it is actually a thick inner-steel jacket with copper clad (or whatever copper-colored metal it is clad in).


#10

Ah, got it. This might be the issue with digitally rendered images. The IT experts doing these are seldomly ammo experts.
A reason why I always prefer real photos…


#11

The following description is from another S&B LE/Military catalog:
“Rounds with FMJ HP projectile (Fe/Tombak jacket with Pb core) with strengthened jacket in the ogival area. The projectile features a significantly improved penetration characteristics in stiff obstacles - steel bodyworks, armour glass plate…”.

S&B claims this round can defeat Class III armour vests.


#12

Fede & EMZ,

Are there web links to the S&B LE/Military catalogs? If not can someone provide PDFs of the catalogs?

Thanks,

Brian


#13

I have a handful of these and just melted out the core from one of the projectiles to see if it would exceed the “25% jacket rule” amendment to the 1986 federal pistol AP law. The jacket weighs exactly 28gr, so that does come in at just over 25% of the overall 108gr projectile weight.

If you don’t know what I am talking about, it is to do with the federal 1986 law which restricted the “importation” and “manufacture” of pistol caliber armor piercing projectiles. Import & Manufacture actually have very specific definitions in the law which state that this is something on a commercial for-profit scale (not just small quantity collecting). The restrictions meant that one would have to have either an FFL-10 or FFL-11 to import or manufacture, and these are harder to acquire than the standard FFL license, or even the machine gun class-III license. Anyway, the original law defined AP pistol projectiles as those having a projectile, or projectile core made entirely of brass, iron, steel, tungsten, or basically any metal as hard or harder than brass. Sometime around 1993 the anti-gun politician types were made aware of the “loophole” that existed with the potentially evil Swedish M/39B 9mm which was a penetrator, but did not fit the definition based on core or monolithic projectile. This led to the likes of Daniel Patrick Moynihan and Bill Clinton throwing around the term “cop killer” and having the 1986 law’s definitions updated to include the 25% jacket weight rule to address this and it was added to the 1994 crime bill (the A.W.B.).

So long-story-short anyone commercially importing these S&B HP enhanced penetrator 9mm rds into the U.S. would need to have an FFL-11. I was sort of hoping they would be 24% of the overall projectile weight, but oh well. Not likely that anyone would import them en-masse anyway. To be honest, the ambiguity and partial translation lackings would almost certainly make for these to skirt in undetected anyway since they don’t say “piercing” or “penetrator” on the package, and most will misinterpret the “HP” to mean hollow-point. The only FFL-11’s I know of are some of the relevant mid to large size manufacturers since the combined total of ATF and ITAR fees is at least $2800 per year for the license, and even then they are only selling the product to law enforcement & government agencies