Rem .45 ACP Shot cartridges


#1

I have had these in my ammo locker for years and have never thought of them as collectables but now I wonder? They are no longer available from Remington and I have not seen them advertised in my meager collection of older references.

I know other shot loads are available and have been over the years but most are shot cups, like the ones CCI currently markets. This is the only crimped brass case I have seen in the .45 ACP. Plenty of .22 LR and the like, yes. The box says each has 650 #12 lead shot pellets in it.

The headstamp reads (R-P 45 ACP SHOT)


#2

Shotmeister,

Probably not a “rarity” at this point or any time in the near future, but I always figured things like this come off the “shootin’ stuff” list for me when they stopped making them after only a short time in production. I liked it when it came out for the unique case and headstamp and of course, stuck one in the collection. Which reminds me, I want to grab a set of the Remington electric primed rifle ammunition before it dries up. Apparently another not so sucessful adventure…

Dave


#3

This cartridge was not out long, and is often over-looked by pistol-caliber collectors. I agree with the assesment that it should now be treated as a collectable, although at this time, not a pricey one. It will not take many more years before one looking for this round with the “SHOT” headstamp has to really go out looking for one, instead of having them fall into the lap.

Dave - where are you going to find “a set” of the Electronux cartridges to “grab?” I have been looking for any, even one in one caliber, of the pistol ammunition since it was first fooled with by Remington, to no avail. I don’t know what exists, but I can tell you for sure that there are a couple or three variations of 9mm Para, at least. I don’t have a single round from this series.


#4

Shotmeister,

What is the Load Index Number for that load. I do not recall seeing them listed in any of the catalogs. Is the address on the box Bridgeport, CT or Lonoke, AR? I would appreciate it if you could send me a scan of all six sides to my email address (click on email below).


#5

John,

Sorry to not be clear and having strayed from the auto pistol side of the topic. I was refering to the still common EtronX rifle/ammunition series Remington introduced around 2000 or so. I think it is or is soon to be discontinnued. I equated it due to it’s short lived commercial life and it’s the kind of off-beat stuff I like to pick up that, while common at present, is likely not to stay that way forever.

That being said…Care to elaborate on the “Electronux” cartridge on a new thread? What calibers you know of, when, etc? A rare bird I assume as you are without an example!

Thanks,
Dave


#6

Since I am not into sporting rifle, I don’t know if we are talking about the same stuff or not. I kind of winged the spelling as I remembered seeing it. I have never seen any of the stuff with either spelling in any gun shop in our area.

Being retired for 8 years now, I am kind of out of what is going on. Our shop carried about everything in ammo. Few other shops in the San Francisco area carry much of anything.

I can’t start a thread on the stuff I am talking about. I could never even get any literature on it out of Remington. I don’t know anything about it, except that I have seen two or three different specimens of 9mm picked up by another collector, at the last St. Louis show, or the one before that. I forget.
No clue as to where they came from. The info was not forthcoming and it was not my place to ask the source.


#7

Ron,

The cartridge first appeared in the 1988 catalog and last appeared in the 1993 catalog, as far as I can tell.

Product code is R45AP5. It was sold in 20-round boxes. with a picture of a rattlesnake on the top. It is the green over yellow type box. My box has the Dupont marking and the Lonoke Arkansas address.

The rare round is the first production or preproduction rounds with a standard headstamp (does not have the word “SHOT” on the headstamp).


#8

John,

Is this the type of round your refering to?

Steve


#9

John–You beat me to the punch on the info about the cataloging of the R45AP5 load. You are right about the years 1988-1993 in the 20 round box. However, there is another box variation that would be even better to keep as a collectible. In 1990, and only for that one year, Remington listed a 25 round box as well as the 20 round box. I presume the 25 round box is a square box packed 5 x 5 rounds rather than the long 2 x10 style.

Can anyone post a picture of the 25 round box?


#10

I have a .45 Auto shot round in a light-alloy (silver-coloured) case with a clear plastic top-wad so you can see the shot. Headstamp CCI N R 45 AUTO. I’ve no idea how common that is.


#11

Tony,

That CCI loading is still being made and is part of their fairly extensive shot load line from .22 rimfire to .45 Colt. Most use a clear blue plastic capsule to contain the shot. I guess the .45 Autoloaders would be too rough on the plastic so they did the extended case deal not unlike the .45 ACP shot loads made for U.S. military use. Interesting that their 9mm version uses a plastic “bullet” rather than an extended case like the .45 ACP and .40 S&W version. The “NR” stands for non-reloadable as the aluminum case is Berdan primed and I believe the calibers in this series without extended cases use the standard “Blazer” line of disposable cases.

Dave


#12

Thanks Dave!

Do these shot loads generate enough recoil to cycle an M1911 action?


#13

Tony,

I’ve never used any of the autoloader calibers, but the revolver loads are certainly not wimpy. The .45 ACP is listed as 117 gr. of #9 shot at 1100 fps. This works out to about 314 foot pounds of muzzle energy vs. about 370 foot pounds for a classic “hard ball” load. I would guess if a lighter target load works the action of a particular gun, these shot loads would too. Feeding might be another issue?

It looks like Shotmeister may have tried out the Remington version which I think has similar ballistics and maybe he could elaborate on how well they function…

Dave


#14

Firstly, not sure if that load of 220 swift ammo is the same thing I am thinking of. Are they electric primed? When I have more time, I will have to re-educate myself on these. I know I have a file on them, but have so much paper in my office right now, working on the ammo section of my Makarov book, if I put it on the desk in front of me, I wouldn’t be able to find it 30 seconds from now.

About the Remington shot load working a pistol, yes they do. When we first got the ammunition, I fired one full box from my full-sized Colt Govt. Model pistol. At ten yards, approximately, the shot pattern was round and filled most of the paper of a standard NRA 25-yard Timed fire target. Point of aim was standard 6 O’Clock hold. I had one malfunction - a smokestack jam, for a 5% malfunction rate, which I consider quite acceptable for this type of specialty ammunition. This was in a gun that simply does not jam with hardball of combat practice loads with a 200 grain Hensley & Gibbs 68 lead SWC bullet.

I have not fired the CCI version, but I have heard that it does work the actions also, and with good dependability.

The snake on the box is probably ill-advised. If you have time to shoot one in the wild, you have time to walk away from it. They do have their purpose in the overall scheme of things, even though I am terrified of even the sight of a big gopher snake, much less a rattler. I would look upon these cartridges as a survival load only, not a for defense and not a “snake killer” unless you need to eat it. Uhhhgggg!


#15

I only fired one round thru a Colt Officer’s Model and frankly, I do not recall if it cycled or not. The person who gave me the ammo said they would not cycle but he only shot 5 rds and I don’t know from what gun. So, I would refer to John’s evaluation but add, they might or they might not. Gun depending.

Todays shot loads for pistols seem to be #9, as far as I can tell, but these are #12. Also, since #12 is not a standard size used in most shotshells, was it made just for this load? The crimping process seems unigue too. Surely they had to make rather extensive modifications to the production line to run these and the production numbers probably are not great. Seems like a lot of expense with little prospect for significant return.

As to the ethics of using them on sankes, as the box implies, … With each passing year I tend to mellow more, and perhaps now live and let live might be wiser than my old moto of shoot on sight. I am not fast enough to draw and accurrately fire on an aggressive snake before it hits us anyway.


#16

John and Shotmeister,

Good info on functionality in autoloaders. I’m mostly a wheel gun guy…
As far as blasting snakes goes, if they are just being “critters” I leave them alone. If they somehow become “varmints” (which the snakes around these parts rarely do) these shot loads are effective.

#12 shot is mostly used in the rimfire shot loads and you also see #11 in the CCI .22 Magnum. The #12 is so fine it reallly looses its umpf (sp.?) quick as distance increases. Seems Remington had “varmint” type snakes that were too close for comfort in mind when they marketed this product.

John,

That is the Remington stuff I was refering to and yes, it is electric primed. The hype was a lock time at the speed of light for some perceived improvement in accuracy. The guns were priced very high and the ammunition wasn’t cheap either. I looked at current availability of the ammunition which was/is made in .22-250, .220 Swift, and .243 Winchester and Midway still lists it and the primers as well (at $169 per 1000! If I recall corectly from their last flier) so they may still be in production, but my understanding is it may not be for long. Would be interesting to learn what other calibers Remington played with when they got on the electric kick…

Dave


#17

“Tastes just like chicken.”


#18

I have 3 of the electronic rifle cartridges they are 220 Swift 22-250, and .243 they all have plastic tipped bullets. All headsamps are identical to that time frames normal R P brass with an odd looking primer resembling the old Winchester protected primer. If memory serves me right I bought them from Ammo One 5 or 6 years ago.

Hope this helps.

DougD