S&B 9mm odd headstamp

Matt as for the hs on top. I just got the info that this is a cartridge made for the Czech police.
And here it is week 14 in 2016.

Interesting, so that headstamp is from exactly one year ago. Thanks!

For CZ police there’s not NATO symbol used… I have met several of those “special” lots / loads but non of those bears the cross in circle (additional lots/dates are quite common). There are brass monoliths HP, 100grs JSP TC, 115/124grs FMJ RN. This particular case was made for CZ Army or any other NATO country.

The “ZVS” headstamp looking like the company’s logo has been used in dated 9x19 headstamps since at least 2011, but it seems that it’s new to commercial cartridges.

Matt - that’s a great bunch of headstamps. The W M A 1 6 (without the
NATO Mark) surprises me. I had only heard of that on an early round
from them, dated “12” and I only have that one in a fired case. Very scarce
I think. Never had seen a ZVS with that stylized headstamp lettering, either.
The two different HRTRS headstamps are nice, too. Boy, its sure hard to
keep up the way these headstamps are coming out.

What is “Fed Arm S.A.L.F.”? I must have missed something there?

John Moss

John - Fedarm is a manufacturer in Arkansas who produces large quantities of bulk reman ammo. It is generally unremarkable except that they somehow have their own proprietary projectiles which I have seen nowhere else, which they call the S.A.L.F. for solid-alloy-lead-free. It’s a monolithic cupro-nickel as far as I can tell, and they are all light for caliber. The 9mm projectiles weighs only 80gr and screams at 1400+ fps at normal pressure levels. They use fired / processed brass, and from purchasing some 1000 rd lots of 9mm and .45acp from them, as well as buying unloaded processed 9mm brass from them I have found a bunch of headstamps.

I discussed them in earlier threads where there are lots of headstamp photos showing the variation found in the 1000 rd lots:

I probably missed a lot of these threads, depending on when they were.
It hasn’t been a very good year; lots of distractions, especially from the
passing of several friends. I saw in another current thread you explained the
very question I asked - I looked at that thread after asking it.

Thanks for the huge effort in answering it. I will try to review all those threads.
I am sorry for the bother caused.

John

The info on the S&B headstamp came from the Slovak Police.
After all NATO symbols are widely spread.

Living close to S&B factory I’m quite aware what are the cartridge lots currently contracted/loaded :-). There might be an option that this particular lot failed to be NATO accepted and sold for the lower price to police department (on the box usually stated FOR TRAINING PURPOSES ONLY). Will post the picture of such an box once back to CZ. Tomas

Matt, thanks for posting those headstamps. I like the new ZVS stamp!

Tomas, I look forward to any photos of S&B boxes and/or headstamps you may wish to post.

With so many different headsramps that S&B makes it seems that one can concentrate collecting just on S&B 9x19mm rounds.

Find enclosed couple of samples of S&B special lots boxes - sometimes it’s just simple black stamp either on front side or just the lot No. on the side of the standard commercial packaging; there’re using light green boxes with variation of stamps; there are using plain white boxes with the sticker around the whole box…etc, etc…I’m not collecting boxes, these few are just random samples of boxes I use for my reloads…

Trabi,

GREAT PICTURES!!! Any other box pictures would be greatly appreciated.

The light green boxes indicate some kind of change in headstamp? Can you explain, please?

Thank you,

Brian

I’ve got a bunch of S&B 9mm with a NATO stamp… Has green or blue primer sealant. Disregard… Seen original post was March and I thought it was of this year. Sorry for the bump.

Basically a contribution to any thread is appreciated, no matter how old it is.

At least this is my view.

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The Herters headstamps are produced after Cabela’s bought the trade name and begin to headstamp them. Who is the manufacturer?

Vic - not an easy question to answer. I can give some examples, but I can only address the subject of auto pistol ammo sold under the Herters brand name. Some 9 mm is made in the Czech Republic. It is a fair assumption from cartridge characteristics that it is from Sellier & Bellot, and has an odd abbreviation for Herter’s on the headstamp, “HRTRS” as I recall, which only saved them two spaces for spelling it completely out. Other Herters-boxed 9 mm Para is made in Russia, and has Russian headstamps. Their aluminum case ammo is made by CCI. I have Herter’s brand .380 Auto and it is made in Idonesia, with a “PIN” headstamp signifying “PINDAD.” It is possible that if I went thru my complete box collection, pretty much impossible for me right now as I am undergoing a complete reorganization of my files and of my box collection, I would find other countries.

It is very hard to tell who is making what these days, especially if the box is not specific - such as “Made in the EU.” You pretty much have to go on a box by box basis. Even that can be misleading, although I am not stating it is so on any of the Herter’s stuff. I mention it only because there are rules about how much of the components or loading procedures produce a product that must then be labeled as having been made in one country, even if much of the components are from other countries. I don’t know the specifics of these rulings, and they may differ from country to country.

I know that this makes the answer to your question about as clear as swamp water! It simply is, what it is!

John Moss

Thank you I guess Its time I begin the hunt and see what I find. Vic

The HRTRS 9mm Para headstamped rounds were definately made by S&B,

Lew

Yes indeed. I can confirm this as well. I actually have some somewhere… Bought at my local bass pro shops store. I’ve ran some through my chronograph, pretty hot stuff too. Pushing 1300 fps muzzle velocity from a Glock 17. For a 115 grain bullet, it’s the hottest I’ve ever shot through my chrono. In general sellier and bellot ammo is hot. Their 7.92x57 fmj clocked in at 2,648 fps for a 196 fmj. Which is 3052 ftlbs of energy at muzzle… Not for the recoil shy folks. Gave me a headache. Shot out of my 1944 dot Russian capture K98k, for those who want to know. Sellier and bellot is about all I buy. Their velocity and accuracy is superior to just about anything out there.