Steel jacket 25 autos


#1

My Webly and Scott .25 hates copper jkt. bullets. It was apparently designed to use steel jkt. ammo. It just will not swallow those soft jackets. Does anyone know a source for steel jkt. 25 auto ammo ?


#2

Bullet jacket material is not likely to be the cause, since none of the Eley or Kynoch .25 auto cartridges have a steel jacketed bullet. They are all CN or GM. The pistol was assuredly not made specifically for steel-jacketed bullets.


#3

I think I had mentioned earlier that my .25 pistol has a decidedly functional preference for CCI Blazer 50 grain FMJ over all other brands. And I have tested about all of them. If you haven’t tried those yet, and assuming you can get them, it might be worthwhile. I now have a large supply of partial boxes of .25 ammunition of other brands I will probably never use.

From what I have read, at least in .25 ACP, FMJs are considered the best performers to achieve effective penetration, and the more expensive wonder bullets don’t live up to their billings in that caliber.


#4

I will try those. Thank you. This little girl was fitted for a silencer and I carried it for many years on official business loaded with lead bullet reduced loads mated to the silencer. It used to work fine. Now it doesn’t.


#5

Interesting. The .25 is my carry pistol. As I seldom wear anything other than bermuda-style shorts and T-shirts since my retirement, a .25 is about the only thing small enough to fit in a front pocket without showing. As they say, it’s not a .45 but better than throwing rocks.


#6
  1. The aluminum cased Blazer cartridge is spec’d by some makers (Diamondback for instance); the alum. case tends to be ‘slicker’ than many brass cases.

  2. I’d have the mag and recoil spring replaced with original factory components simultaneously…differential wear of those 2 springs can make feed/function iffy, esp. in very small pistols.

  3. Use with a muzzle can can also place unusual wear on pistol components; some handguns will literally break when used with a suppressor esp. if the suppressor is long/heavy/unbuffered enough to place ‘seesaw’ wear on the barrel/locking pieces.

If none of that gets the lil lady up and running, there are several good suppressor companies that can help address the problems.


#7

Original factory parts for a Webley are going to be hard to find. I would imagine it has the same slide spring as the .32 MP (Metropolitan Police) model which was much more plentiful and may turn up with a breaker such as Numrich.

The S&B .32 Auto ammunition I used to buy for my Browning was steel jacket (back in the days when my government believed I could be trusted to own one) and also good in every other sense, function, feed, accuracy etc. It was also top end in terms of power but more importantly recoil.

I would however cast doubt on the belief that it was designed to operate with SJ ammunition. Back when it was made the staple fodder would have been Kynoch ammunition and not much else, so big was their influence here in Britain and I don’t believe they made steel, as John has said.
Steel jackets for small pistol calibres was more of a European thing but not a British thing at all.

Its a simple blowback action, as long as the spring is up to the job it should work fine but the spring is going to be anything up to a hundred and five years old now, so it may have just gone weak, its got a lot of metal to move. Try some dry lube on the slide that might help if friction is adding to the problem.

The magazine spring again could have lost its edge and not be pushing the rounds up fast enough to feed properly. These sort of pistols are often stored for many decades with a full mag and the spring takes on a set Check out the lips of the mag as well, they can be distorted or worn and be the cause of problems.

It could just be if you are using factory ammo that the litigation consious manufacturers are down loading the ammo these days, fearful of the cheaply made Saturday Night Specials made for this calibre and it hasn’t got enough recoil energy to move the slide back far enough. From memory it would have a heavy slide and would require a certain amount of recoil to get it moving. It shared the same slide as the .32 and its heavy for such a small calibre. Try some really full power reloads (if I’m allowed to sat that on here?) its built very strongly for a .25 and will take them easily. Its a down bored .32 in reality and has plenty of strength.
Just a few ideas to get you started.


#8

There’s probably nothing wrong with the little Webley’s recoil spring, but if there is it’s a real problem–because it’s a vee spring which engages the slide by a lever. Sounds odd, but it works. Jack


#9

I do not recommend handloading “hot loads” for a Webley .25 auto. Just as was said, the gun is probably over 100 years old now. It was never designed for “hot loads.” Blowback pistols are made to operate within a given range of chamber pressures, and timing is important.

If I had one of these pistols, I would put it on the wall and get something more modern. There are 9 mm Para caliber auto pistols today that are not appreciably heavier than the all-steel Webley, and while bigger, I would question that they are enough bigger to make any kind of real difference in concealability. I carried for years a Colt Commander .45 auto pistol without ever experiencing any challange to see my permit (which means the pistol was concealed adequately), and still carry, when I bother, a Colt Cobra (light, but not a tiny revolver) or a Browning HP full-size 9 mm Para caliber pistol.

If I was so fond of a Webley .25 auto that I wanted to still carry it, I would give the gun to a competent gunsmith and let him work out what is wrong with it. JMO


#10

John
I don’t think there was any suggestion this was a carry gun. A lot of people, myself included, get a lot of pleasure from using these bygones for the purpose they were intended.
Just to keep it ammo related that applies to ammo as well. Some on here may consider it wrong but shooting old ammo comes into that remit as well occasionally for the enjoyment. Indulging myself with the occasional original round through the Martini is nostalgia.

Also, I didn’t recommend hot loads I said full loads and by that I meant making sure the loads were up to spec.

Vince


#11

Hello
There is absolutely no need to use reduced loads when shooting 25 ACP.
Indeed the ctge is already subsonic !

If you gun was working well with reduced loads it means something (recoil spring for example) was modified when the guy made the work to put a silencer on the gun.

Therfore using regular ctges can give you problems because they are too hot for a light spring

JP


#12

Vince - I too enjoy shooting old guns once in awhile, and have a number that I do shoot, mostly old Mausers and Winchesters. When I was collecting auto pistols years ago, I shot many of them, including some with original ammunition that, for the most part, still went off. The most exotic I suppose was my 1896 6.5 Bergmann, that I fired five original cartridges from Keller & Company out of. They all went bang!

That said, with a malfunctioning pistol I will stand by everything I said. If one is not going to have a competent gunsmith find the problem and fix it, firing it risks further damage and broken parts. With a nice little Webley, especially one that seems to have some sentimental value (a
phenomena that I completely agree with and fall prey to myself), I would either fix it or relegate it to the status of a collector’s item, which they are if in nice condition otherwise.

JMHO, which after 36 years in the firearms profession, often differs from that of others. I have seen a lot of nice collectibles ruined one way or another - a lot, in these case, meaning literally hundreds.