Swiss 6.45mm Gewehr Leuchtspurpatrone 80

Hi Paul

Yes you be right about that wax(never thought about the sniper cartridges)

from the website of RUAG

SWISS P – SNIPER’S CHOICE (CAL .338 LAPUA MAG, .300 WIN MAG, .308 WIN, .223 REM)
Our sniper ammunition fulfils all requirements for special forces and police deployments. SWISS P rifle ammunition has outstanding precision and ballistics.

Armour Piercing (AP) high-penetration capacity
Styx Action high-impact deformation
Target for precision and training
Ball ammunition for use by armed forces under international conventions
Tactical for combating targets behind glass
Subsonic (different ballistics) extra-heavy projectiles for special requirements

Today I have a email from Swiss with a answer on my question about the wax…
The wax on the bullet is for grease the bullet in the barrel because that the muzzle velocity is 320 m/s

regards
gyrojet

Today I have a email from Swiss with a answer on my question about the wax…
The wax on the bullet is for grease the bullet in the barrel because that the bullet get only 320 m/s

regards
gyrojet

And what about the .300 Win Mag with AP bullet? Is it subsonic too?

I don’t think that the .300 Win Mag P with AP bullet is subsonic because of his
muzzle velocity min 855 m/s
But the velocity of the .300 Win Mag AP is much higher then the other .300 Win Mag"s and thats the reason of the wax.

There is a .300 Whisper Swiss P Subsonic with a muzzle velocity 320m/s
with the super heavy hollow-point projectile (HPBT) for silent use at distances up to 100m

regards
gyrojet

I don’t think that the .300 Win Mag P with AP bullet is subsonic because of his
muzzle velocity min 855 m/s
There is a .300 Whisper Swiss P Subsonic with a muzzle velocity 320m/s
with the super heavy hollow-point projectile (HPBT) for silent use at distances up to 100m

regards
gyrojet

Then, the reason for the wax is NOT that the bullet is subsonic.

Gyrojet, in answer to Jim’s question about the different bullet diameter of 6.35 vs. 6.45 from what the Swiss guys told me the round is the same, it is only a different NAME, something like the 4.85 Enfield or 5mm Enfield, bullet diameter is the same. Just to make sure, I measured all mine and the are all of bullet diameter 6.59mm no matter if they are called 6.45 or 6.35mm (ball, proof, tracer or drill, all the same).

New info about the wax(grease)

The perception is that the grease rings actual improve the accuracy of the round. RUAG, the Swiss ammo, manufacturer claims there’s no difference in accuracy between greased and ungreased round (at least with their 5.6 GP90 ammo), but many shooters disagree

It principle use was to seal the powder from any moisture. This was used with only the GP11
7.5x55 that had the four crimp crimping that was located about 3mm below the neck. This type of crimping did not create a perfect seal. The EMF in Thun move away from this type of sealer and went to a different type that is internal. At the same time the crimping went to the top of the neck and was all around the bullet head.

Will,
Thank you for clarifying that point. Is it true to say that none of the 6.35mm rounds have a headstamp? And would it be a logical conclusion that the 6.35mm is a prototype of the 6.45mm?

Jim - Attached are pictures of packets for the 6.35 and 6.45 GP80. I’ve always understood that it was just a nomenclature change. Judging from these packets, it happened between 1979 and 1980. The rounds associated to these packets are both unheadstamped.

However, below are some rounds that pre-date the 1979 packet that are headstamped. I do not know the designation of these rounds, or if they were being referred to as 6.35 mm at the time.

GP80

All of these rounds are headstamped “12 77”

The rounds on the right are Boxer primed. Note the 2 different primer sizes.

The remaining ball and proof round have the more typical Berdan primer with 3-stab crimp and black annular seal.

Paul

I don’t mean to be a thread necromancer, but can anyone tell me anything about the 5.6mm GP82? Was it substantially different from the GP90?

It appears to have an admirably slender meplat.

Tau, I’m not sure which 5.6mm cartridge you are referring to. I’m certainly not aware of a 5.6mm GP82 nor am I aware of a GP90. I’m wondering if this 5.6mm Eiger is the cartridge that you’re enquiring about…

2_zpsa98a4049

Jim

Tau,
according to the data and a (small) photograph in a Swiss book by Reinhart/am Rhyn no obvious difference between the 5.6 mm GP 82 and today’s 5.6 mm GP 90 can be seen. Bullet weight is given as 4.1 g and muzzle velocity 900 m/s, which is the same as GP 90.

Jim, the GP 90 (their version of the 5.56x45) is the current Swiss rifle cartridge, fired from the Stgw 90 assault rifle.

Yeah, sorry for the confusion, Jim, I’m afraid I was just talking about garden-variety (Swiss) 5.56!

Yep, thank you both for clarifying that. Minutes after my post I thought to check my collection and found there my very own Swiss 5.56mm GP90’s. Sorry!

New info about the wax(grease)

The perception is that the grease rings actual improve the accuracy of the round. RUAG, the Swiss ammo, manufacturer claims there’s no difference in accuracy between greased and ungreased round (at least with their 5.6 GP90 ammo), but many shooters disagree

It principle use was to seal the powder from any moisture. This was used with only the GP11
7.5x55 that had the four crimp crimping that was located about 3mm below the neck. This type of crimping did not create a perfect seal. The EMF in Thun move away from this type of sealer and went to a different type that is internal. At the same time the crimping went to the top of the neck and was all around the bullet head.

The changeover from neck crimping to mouth crimping did not happen concurrently with the move away from external waxing. My stock of 7.5mm GP11 shooting ammo is mouth crimped plus it has the wax seal, the lot number is 15.6.79 A. I believe that the wax stopped being used about 1981/82. There are enough target shooters who believe that the ammo is better with the wax that a commercial tool is available to add the wax seal/lube.

gravelbelly