This is Britain in 2010


Report in the current edition of Target sports.

Police firearms instructor fined

A former police firearms instructor has been fined £750 ($1125) after he inadvertantly kept two bullets (sic) without a firearms certificate.
At a hearing in the High Court in Glasgow Sgt Steven Campbell of Strathclyde Police admiited having the ammunition without the necessary paperwork.

Judge Lord Woolman told Mr Campbell he would not impose a jail sentence telling Mr Campbell “You of all people should know the strict laws surrounding ammunition”

Now as a former secretary of what was a busy club before the days of the handgun ban I can confirm that when clearing up at the end of the day you find all sorts of stuff on the floor and the inclination is to put it in your pocket and deposit it in the safe later.

Two rounds of ammunition, for a firearms instructor with no gun to fire it in and no suggestion of any criminal intent seems harsh in the extreme. What seems even harsher is that the prosecuction must have been brought by his own collegues.

The reason I am bringing this matter to the forum is to high light the necessity to UK collectors that there is no margin for error in keeping your collections totally clean and free from risk.


Now I know why Falcon wants to move to US and run for the President. We’ll help him with an American certificate of birth, of course.


I hope you don’t plan on testifying for him at his trial, Vlad, your accent ain’t exactly Joisey!!!;)


How can a case like that go to trial? In the High Court as well (highest Court in the land) There is something wrong with a system that allows such things to happen to a Firearms Instructor when criminals and drug dealers are running amok with guns all over the place. Maybe he should have received a warning or a telling off but now he has a criminal conviction his job and pension are history. Probably all over a couple of rounds he picked up and put in his locker while getting changed to go home. ( Police lockers are subject to random searches from time to time) I feel truely sorry for the man.


I don’t know what this place is coming to. Even though the election is next week, I’m sure whatever party gets in will continue to push this PC madness. Hopefully I can leave this place for good sooner rather than later. How did we let “Great” Britain go from the country that once ruled 1/4 of the Earth’s surface to the mess we are in now???


Lots of history books explain it…basically, each great nation in history has had its time in the sun before being eclipsed for one reason or (more usually) several. 'Twas ever thus, and will ever be so. The one thing which all such nations share in common is the firm belief, while at the height of their power, that this will never happen to them!

(An amusing story I read this week, by a scientist who was talking to an American audience about the potential for the Yellowstone supervolcano to blow, and explaining that it might not happen for another 250,000 years, by which time humanity would probably be extinct. “What?” said a woman indignantly. “even Americans?”)

Incidentally, the term “Great” Britain has nothing to do with political status, it is a geographical term which simply means the largest island of the British Isles. So Northern Ireland is not in “Great Britain”, only England, Scotland and Wales. Hence the official name for the country: “The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland”.


I knew that the term “Great” wasn’t actually political, it was just used as a saying in my posting. The trouble is though, we haven’t got to the state we are in now through invasion, famine, natural disaster etc. The worst thing is that people actually voted for these idiots.


I suspect that this one is drifting somewhat off-topic, but the sad fact is that in a democracy the people get the governments they deserve.

The reasons for the UK’s decline were many and various; perhaps the most obvious being the crippling effect of WW1, which left the country completely broke and exhausted as well as missing a large chunk of its young men. But the UK was losing its industrial and economic leadership before that even started. WW2 was another major economic disaster; we only paid off the debt to the USA a few years ago.


Tony - right on. The U.S. started its decline when we stopped being a republic and became a democracy. California’s gun and ammo laws, despite the 2nd Amendment to our National Constitution, a paper long ignored by our Governments, Federal and State, show you what Democracy leads to - Progressive Socialism.

Democracies are not usually “murdered” by outside forces, but rather commit suicide.

John Moss


Bringing the discussion back on topic a bit. The thing that worries me is the demonisation of ammunition when in the abscence of a gun or any visible crimial intent the judge is talking about a possibility of a jail sentence. I thought intent was a key factor in British law.
In my time I have known (past tense) quite a number of collectors and battlefield enthusiasts who have had a pretty cavalier attitude to live ammunition on the basis that in their eyes they were not doing anything wrong in picking it up and taking it home as keepsakes. That worries me a lot.