THV drawing


#1

Here is a THV drawing dated from the early eighties.
Many different shapes exist for each caliber.
JP
PS: Hi, DK conf., I sent you the magasines scans by private mail because unfortunately I don’t think I am allowed to post them here for copyright reasons.


#2

There’s an article on THV ammo on my website, illustrated by photos and diagrams, here: quarry.nildram.co.uk/THV.htm


#3

thanks Tony,
I put that here because I thought it will interest some people.
Be carefull, all the drawings are not the same
jp


#4

Some THV rounds, showing the many shapes in the various calibers. This is probably a drop in the bucket - there are many, many more shapes, especially in 9mm Parabellum. Some of these will look the same in the picture. They may, however, be actually different projectiles in some small way (diameter of the post, etc.), while others might be the same projectiles but with different headstamped cases. Comments on the cartridges themselves are from the best of my memory, notes on my former collection of these and from looking at the picture. Please forgive any errors in identification.

Top row: From left to right, the first five cartridges are all 7.65mm Browning (.32 Auto). they were evenly spaced, but rolled before scanning. The Gilding metal bullet not in a case may not be French. I was never able to positively identify it. The next four rounds are 9mm Court (.380 Auto), all French. The final two rounds are 7.62 Tokarev, with projectiles made and loaded in the Republic of South Africa, using Chinese primed cases (probably loaded ammo with the original bullet pulled out).

2nd Row: These are all French variations of 9mm Parabellum THV. They may vary only in headstamp in some cases, as mentioned above. Again, one of the cartridges rolled before scanning - there is no reason for the gap and for two rounds being close together.

3rd Row: Left to right, the first two cartridges are French and may not be considered to be THV types, even though they are from SFM. I simply have no documentation as to exactly how the Factory classified them.
The new one is in a Geco case, and could be French, German or South African. Again, no documentation. The fourth round is Iraqi, with an Iraqi headstamp. The next round is from Slovakia, and perhaps some would feel that it is not a copy of THV. I feel it copies the concept, if not the exact form. The other three and the two loose projectiles are all made and loaded in the Republic of south Africa.

Bottom Row. These are all French variants of the THV in .45 A.C.P. (.45
Auto) caliber. the second and third specimens from the left appear to have the same bullet, with one only seated out slightly farther. The others have different shaped projectiles.

Please note that these are all auto pistol rounds - I do not collect revolver cartridges, nor do I have any rifle rounds of this type.

John Moss


#5

Nice collection!

  • on the first row the lonely bullet looks like a SIB, doesn’t it ?
  • on the third row the fifth starting from the left looks like a Fiocchi one

No need I put some drawings, there are too many variations !
JP


#6

Those are really interesting projectiles. What does THV mean? So many different kinds.

Jason


#7

[quote=“APFSDS”]Those are really interesting projectiles. What does THV mean? So many different kinds.

Jason[/quote]

Tr


#8

Thank you so much JP. I bet they haul butt! Really cool shape.

Jason


#9

J-P: You are absolutely right about the lonely bullet. There is no question that it is a SIB. I never had a SIB round apart so I didn’t know what the part seated in the case looked like. Also, it is one of my early scans and I didn’t think to check it with the entry you made on SIB recently. It is the same, except for being 9mm, as the SIB bullet shown in the cutaway drawing. I will change my notes.

The fifth one from the left in the third row is not Fiocchi. I didn’t even know that they made one. However, this one is made by Povaszke Strojarne in Slovakia and had the “PS” headstamp. As I recall, I had one also with “PS.” headstamp (a dot after the PS). Of course, I say that it is made by Povazska Strojarne, because of the headstamp and the book on Slovak ammunition, but these days, who knows, with everyone in Europe making ammunition and components for everyone else.

Are the Italian THV rounds usually found with GFL headstamp? Do you or anyone else looking at this thread, have a picture of one?


#10

John,

  1. I never seen Fiocchi ctges loaded with THV bullets, but only the bullets.

  2. I had one, but I don’t have it anymore because I traded it.
    This bullet was more or less like a French bullet.

  3. I said Fiocchi bullets existed in an old topic (it was the same period of time when I put a lot of pictures of Fiocchi boxes).

  4. But, I had (or perhaps still have) also one which looks like the one we are talking about.
    Because of the long tip I thought it was an unfinished bullet.
    JP


#11

While doing a search in the forum I rediscovered this thread and realized that I knew what the two cartridges on the left of the third row are. They are French “ALIA” cartridges with an aluminum jacket, and a pointed steel penetrator core. Apparently designed by the same inventor(s) as the THV. The ALIA was only around from 1980 to 1984 until the THV essentially supplanted it. I have been looking for more info on the ALIA of late, but aside from a blurb in an old DWJ mag and a couple of tips from people, this article from the July, 1981 AMI is the only solid thing I have found on them:

That is just page 1, there are 5 pages to the article, and it is a great write-up, but it is mostly about performance, and not much on history. So I don’t know exactly when it became available, who invented it, or when exactly and why it was not pursued further beyond 1984.


#12

On the THV collection, the cartridge second row number 3 from the left is a Ladri


#13

Seeing this thread again reminded me to publish a few things to supplement the excellent material John provided.

These are all from South Africa. Note the silver color bullet (second from left) is aluminum and pnly weighs 13gr as compared to the brass bullet next to it which weighs 39 gr. Note that John pictures this same aluminum THV bullet. I wonder what use a 13gr bullet could have!

The bullets on the far right are tracers. On the right is the bullet and seperate tracer component. Next to it is the assembled tracer THV.

These are some other THV type loads and bullets.

Beginning on the left,

  1. This load has a Geco headstamp and I was told when I got it that it was made in Germany to try out the THV bullet concept. Having said that I have the identical load that has been attributed to Swiss manufacture!!! Although it is not obvious in this picture, this bullet is distinctively different from the French bullets. The SFM bullets have a continous curve from the tip to the outer diameter of the bullet. On these German/Swiss bullets the curve ends and leaves a flat area that is very noticable before the full bullet diameter.
  2. This is a fired nylon bullet from SFM. I have no idea of the purpose of trying a THV bullet in nylon
  3. This is th Slovak THV-like bullet. Note that it does not have a recessed base like the THV, and also has a boattail.
  4. This is the Fiocchi “THV” mentioned earlier. I understand there are a number of variations of this bullet, but all similar to this shape. This bullet does have a recessed base, but not as deeply as the THV
    5 & 6. These are Finish made copies of the THV. Both have SAKO headstamps and slightly different bullets. One is a dummy with no primer

#14

My illustrated article on THV: quarry.nildram.co.uk/THV.htm

A pic from it: