Topic on a Belgian small ctge with HB impressed on hstp

There was a topic on a Belgian small ctge with a special case with HB impressed on hstp.
It was a short range ctge
And everybody was wondering about the manufacturer.
I think I have found the response but impossible to find the post

the ctge has a reverse taper brass case, round brass lead bullet
it is cal 8 mm and is described page 65 of Logan book

Impossible to find the post

It seems this ctge doesn’t interest many people.
Or perhaps it is too difficult to find the post.
Or perhaps they don’t have the Logan book.
Or perhaps they are too lazy to look for it.

The ctge is also described in Slics auction 2012 (Number 86)

And in conclusion I will not spend my time searching, scanning, editing, modifying, loading on photobucket and then on this forum documents for something people don’t care.

End of the topic.

JP, I can’t find the post either but would be interested in hearing any information about this cartridge.

Hi J.P.

I have been searching for my reference material since your original post. I have just found it. My apologies for my messy filing cabinets.

I have photo copies of the original SFM drawings, or at least I believe they are SFM drawings. They are dated 28 October 1904 on the cartridge and 19 June 1904 for the Auxilliary tube for reduced shooting.

The cartridge is for the Belgium Mauser rifle 8mm (actual cartridge drawings show 7.96-7.98 tolerance). The case is 60mm long with the extension to hold the cartridge, and 53.70mm at the case mouth. The priming is a 5mm Flobert cartridge that has been reconfigured to fit the inside of the brass case. It is a rimfire, and it is Flobert primed.

Due to my changing printers/scanner recently, I have lost the ability to scan and fax. If I can ever figure it out, I will scan this and send it to you. You can put it up in the tread. If not, I will copy it and send that to you, and you can do the same. Sad to say that I am a Ludite when it comes to technology…


hello Will,

Thanks for your attention.

Despite this ctge is well known, people are still wondering who was the manufacturer (HB hstp) (or some pople keep this info for themselves , the result been the same)

There were many advanced hypotheses: Houllier Blanchard, Henri Barthe and so on.
But noone was fitting.

One month ago, when I put the post, I had under my eyes some documents in which was the answer.

I thought it will interest people because they have been wondering for such a very long time who was this manufacturer.

But no question, nothing during one month despite the fact there was a big post on this ctge, which was also in Logan book and in many auction books).

This prooved me the people didn’t care about this ctge.

There is a French proverb saying : “It is useless to be more catholic than the Pope”

therfore, a waiting enough time for someone interested to ask, I took what was interesting me among these documents and gave the ones not interesting me.

The only thing I remember : it was a small Belgian manufacturer.



JP - Please don’t be so impatient about waiting for a reply. Not everyone has the time, all the time, to immediately do research on everything they would like to on the Forum. I am retired, and still find it hard to answer some items, as many times I spend several hours on the computer and in my library researching a single answer. I am sure from the fine material printed on this forum that many others also spend much time on this. There are many questions on the Forum. All deserve an answer, of course, but Forum users can only do what they can do - everything can’t be done in a matter of hours or even days.

Your topics are interesting to many people, I dare say they are to most people on the Forum. Give them a fair chance to answer before you deprive them or your own great knowledge and experience in the field of ammunition, please.

Thank you.


There are two reasons the people put topics on this forum:

  1. Either to ask info they need
  2. Or to share info with the others.

Why do they share info ?

  1. Either because they return the favour to other people.
    (they got asnswers from them before and it is normal they help the other when they can)
  2. Or because they want to initialize a talk with other collectors
    (They show the new ctge on the market, the ctges in their collection, the info they have, aso)

I often open topics asking for some info I need. Most of the time I get answers.
And, not been selfish, I try to help the others when they ask questions.
I play the game like it must be.

Now, when I open a topic giving info, showing drawings, aso, it is not to show off but rather to share info I am lucky to have (lot of time, big library) with others.

It woud be stupid to do as some other people do, meaning keeping this info just for myself till the end of my life, or throwing this info to the garbage because it is no more of interest for me.

I don’t collect anymore these ctges, but I am always interested in reading info on them (on any ctge in fact).

Therefore it is what I call to initialize a talk.

You show something not common and hope the people will be interested, it will please to them, they will participate, talk between them and in conclusion you have good time reading the posts and perhaps you will learn something interesting.
But it is very often not the case.

I will just give you an example.

I put a topic about french experimental ctges.
They are very very rare items and even the documents about them are rare.

On this forum only two people know them and they are french.
In France perhaps only 5 people know these drawings and the ctges.
It gives you an idea of the interest of these documents.

Five people only showed their interest !!
(two french guys I know, one canadian friend and 2 US guys)

Do you think I must spend my time posting things of interest for nobody ?
I don’t think so.


I appreciate your posts even though I have never posted a reply on them. I am a general collector so all cartridge information is of interest to me. I have never posted a reply mostly because I know very little about the subject cartridges. Many of the items you post information on I did not even know they exsisted. Please don’t confuse my lack of reply as a lack of interest. Many collectors myself included don’t have the vast knowledge that some of you guys on this forum have. I try to visit this forum at least once each day because of all the excellent information posted here by people such as yourself.
Thank you…

I agree with Zac. The only thing I ever saw with an HB headstamp was a round listed in an Engel"s Collectibles, Inc. auction #3 back in June of 2002, item 442 page 37. It is listed as a .303 Belgian HB, aka Vase shape Houllier-Blanchard mfg, for Belgium auxiliary, brass case, lead b’t; est value $200-250. I believe it went for $250.
It is an interesting cartridge but not what I collect.
Eager for Knowledge

Will, it would be great if someday you can share those drawings with us. These were probably made by S.A. des Cartoucheries Russo-Belges, because this was the company who patented the auxiliary tubes for this strange looking cartridge. What is also interesting is that the German patent illustrates what it could be a 7.65 x 54 Mauser and the French a 8 x 50 R Lebel.

JP - Your answer to me was interesting and detailed; however, it was pretty irrelevant to my comment. All I asked you to do was be patient in waiting for replies to your very nice postings.
That was it - nothing else. And no, I don’t think anyone should spend their time making postings that are of no interest to other people. Been there; done that. My last comment on the matter, as I am finished with this particular thread, so if you feel the need to reply, please send it as an email direct to me. I think we have been friends long enough that you can do that, so I can reply. I won’t see it on this thread.

Hi Fede.
I would be happy to share the drawings if I could. I recently switched printer/scanner/fax machine for a big industrial unit. When I got it home, I found that I could not fax with it (a major problem for my business) and that I could not scan with it (I have not had an opportunity to read the manual, which I have). When I can figure this beast out, I will try to scan them. Then I need to figure out how to post a photograph. Being a ludite with technology, this too is an issue. It’s not pleasant being an idiot where technology is concerned… However, that is indeed the case for me. If I can, I will send them to you at some point and you can put them on!