Tracer Draw Set


#1

This is a little out of may area. I recently got this bullet draw set. It is a tracer, bullet dia: 0.307" (7.79mm) length: 1.324" (33.6mm) abnd weight 143 grains. At one time it must have been mounted since there is solder and wires on some of the pieces. Does anyone know what it is?

Thanks
Paul


#2

Paul

It doesn’t look like anyone wants to tackle your question. I’ve found that the best way to get responses is for me to post an answer and everyone will immediately jump on board to correct what I’ve said. So, . . .

There are only a very few US tracers with 2 cannelures so I’d bet that yours is from another country. But, first thing is to determine what cartridge it’s for. Measure the distance from the crimping cannelure (the lower one) to the tip. For a 30-06 the dimension would be around .830". For a 7.62x51 it would be about .780".

That should get us started.

Ray


#3

Ray is 100% correct.


#4

Paul

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Ray


#5

:-)


#6

Ray,

The top of the lower cannelure is about 0.83" from the tip. I guess that points toward a 30-06. Any ideas anyone?

Thanks

Paul


#7

I forgot to ask. Are they GM or GMCS?

The Cal 30 M2 Tracer had two cannelures for identification but the bullet was much shorter. There was also some contract tracer ammo loaded in the 50s and 60s (M25) that had two cannelures. It was GMCS. Bullet weight was 145 grains. It looks very much like yours. It could be one of those. HS = RA 57, tip color was orange, now mostly missing.

Ray


#8

A question, not an answer. Were any of these double cannelure bullets ever made specifically so that they could be loaded and properly crimped in either .30-06 (7.62 x 63mm) or .308 (7.62 x 51mm) and crimped on whichever groove was appropriate for the cqartridge in which it was eventually loaded? Or, was it always some sort of identification system?


#9

John

That’s a good question. I can relate what I believe to be the answer but I wouldn’t bet my life on it because I could very well be wrong.

In 1942 a second cannelure was added to the Cal 30 M2 Tracer solely for identification. By the time the T10 was adopted the second cannelure had been dropped. There are exceptions, of course, such as the M25 bullet that I showed. I think it would take someone like Chris P. or HWS to explain it.

Early in the development of the T65 there were some '06 Ball bullets that had an additional cannelure added in order to crimp while still maintaining the specified OAL. That was only done for a short time. By 1946 Frankford was making bullets specifically for the 47mm case.

I also have some examples of bullets that were made for the 49mm case but had a cannelure added so they could be used in the early 51mm case.

But, I have never seen a U.S. 7.62x51 NATO tracer with a bullet with 2 cannelures. Obviously, I haven’t seen every one made and I’ve only pulled a few examples for examination. And I can’t speak for tracers made in any other country, although I know there are several.

Second cannelures on bullets such as tracers, AP, and API are not always in the same location which leads me to believe that they are there for identification only.

Maybe NATO Dave knows. He is certainly more knowledgeable on the 7.62x51 that I am. I will always cede to the real experts. I’d like to know the answers myself.

Ray


#10

Ray,

The draw set is GMCS. I guess should have said that in the first place!

Then I got the set it had the following sectioned bullet with it (GMCS). I don’t think it was a part of the original set because it has a smooth crimping cannelure not a knurled ones as seen on the draws.

Paul


#11

Just taken a very quick look at my notes - tracers from Israel, France and UK appear to have double cannlures - further details and pictures will follow.

Dave S


#12

Dave

I have 2-cannelure tracers from Sweden, Portugal, and FN (Belgium?).

Ray


#13

… and also Raufoss made them.