What type of bullet is in these 11mm Gras cartridges


Trying to figure out if the bullet jacket has any role in identification of the following Gras cartridges.

See pic below;

Top cartridge is an incendiary? (I believe–someone correct me if I am wrong). Headstamp is * SFM* (twined G’s at bottom), Copper primer with red sealant, tinned brass bullet jacket. Red sealant at case mouth.

Going down, #2 has a nickeled bullet and a brass primer with black sealant. Headstamp is GEVELOT *. Is this an M1883 ball?

Number 3 has a copper washed bullet, copper primer with no sealant (this is a maybe due to corrosion). Headstamp is * SFM* (twined G’s at bottom). Is this a ball round?

Number 4 (bottom) has a brass bullet and brass primer, no sealant. Headstamp is LM 4 36 LM. Is this a ball round?

If all are ball rounds why all the different bullet jackets?

Also, heard there is a new book on 8mm Lebel book by Huon that just came out. Anyone know how to get a copy here in the US?

Thanks in advance!

do you know the l title of the book and mayby the author full name. As I would like a copy also but cant find any info.

ok I have the info now from a different post…thanks…paul

Some information from Les Cartouches Du Systeme Gras (Cartridges of the Gras System) by Mention and Ramio, 1988.

No. 1 Incendiary-tracer cartridge, 2nd model, turned brass bullet & tinned, may or may not have a primer with 3 stab crimps, red lacquer seal at primer and case mouth, produced by SFM. (page 108)

See: http://www.histavia21.net/amaviapag/11_gras_avia2.htm ( 11 mm Gras )

No.2 After France signed the La Haye (Hague) Convention in 1899, SFM began production of jacketed model 1879/83 bullets having bullet jackets with different finishes: brass, copper, or nickel. (page 33)

No. 4 Most likely a ball round, late production