The final question is about a little round I have had for over thirty years. When I was given it (by a non cartridge collector) I was told it was an adaptor cartridge. Whilst I very much doubt if this is true, the bullet diameter and large rim do add a degree of crediblity to this claim.

Dimensions are:
Overall length 1.383" (35.12mm)
Case length .902" (22.92mm)
Bullet Diameter .307" (7.82mm)
Neck diameter .324" (8.30mm)
Head diameter .374" (9.50mm)
Rim Diameter .472" (12.00mm)

It is difficult to give any shoulder dimensions because of the shape of the case, but the length of the neck is about .265" (6.73mm).

What is intriguing is the headstamp, “Zi-Di.”



Tony, “ZI-DI” is a tradename created c1911 by Alfred Ziegenhahn and Heinrich Diem (ZIegenhahn-DIem). It was later used by the Ziegenhahn & Son company established in Suhl in 1923 by Alfred Ziegenhahn .

A "Zi-Di .404 Sch

Many thanks for that reply. At least I now know what the headstamp means.

Any idea about what the calibre of mine is? 8 x 23?


It is listed in the ECRA Database as a 7.7x22.7R Unknown and an example is known in the Bill Woodin collection. It doesn’t match anything European that I know of. If it is an adaptor (??) then it would seem that 303 or 7.65x53 maybe the most likely parent calibre.

A real mystery and a nice item to have.

404 schuler magnum loaded cartridges or only empty cases?
All I know about this obscure cartridge is that only bullets were found in Schuler’s factory

Pivi, the subject of the .404 Schuler Magnum was in a previous thread which appears to have been lost when the forum format was changed (??).

In short, a lot has been written about this cartridge, here is a summarised version of what I know:

Evidently designed by Sch

The business still existed in 2006 but their website (ziegenhahn.com/) seems no longer available ?[/quote]


Over my morning coffee I decided to read the “Zi-Di” company history. Their first success was a humane cattle-killer cartridge or device. Perhaps your round is an example of that?